Posted: October 25 2009 at 22:38 | IP Logged

Just checking in... Having a blast taking things apart. Compression test on the engine, which is a '75 360 (Chrysler casts the CID right into the block!!) 90-110, which isn't so hot but the all the plugs are beautiful tan and white. So.. its got hours but its running good. I did the comp test w/ the motor cold so the actuals are a little higher. All my electrics are wired with Marine wire, one less worry. I can't WAIT for spring now.. its gonna be a long winter.. Got my seats out and the side panels off and in my garage. Going over the shifter.. may be just bushings if I can find them.

OK here's my gift to all you seasoned Yachtsmen.. I hadn't had a chance to pump out before hauling. I had to figure out the system anyway.. I had the valve on the seacock open, no problem. But nothing was going into the bucket I placed below the boat. Laying flat on the motor I could see another valve and a pump handle in the far corner of the engine compartment. I could just barely reach it with my fingertips. I pulled on it lightly (I thought) and it opened completely and started dumping raw out the seacock onto the driveway on the side of my house! It didn't come straight down either.. it sprayed like a fire hose. I could barely reach it to push the handle back up, but the hideous damage was done. It was even dripping horizontally along the bottom of the boat. The stench was incredible. When I bought the boat in July the owner had apologized and said it needed to be pumped.. and we used it... hosing it down just spread it around and then the power washer blasted it up onto my house and the fence... and me. ugh. Thank god it started to rain (like crazy) and that dissipated it physically but the pleaseant aroma is still hanging on. This afternoon I saw my next door neighbor looking over the fence at the boat.. I went right past my driveway and came home after it got dark..

Posted: October 26 2009 at 09:58 | IP Logged

my condolences Ray, that is pretty nasty...but not as bad as an incident I witnessed:

I went to the pump out station in Sayville by car to check it out before my first use and there was a boater there geting ready to perform the task.  I looked at this as an opportunity to learn how to do it.  Well, the skipper aparrently was not familiar with the machinery.  As he attempted to pump out the holding tank his wife kept checking and saying it was not emptying.  Instead of sucking the waste he somehow pressurized the holding tank and when he removed the pumpout hose a $#!+ geyser blasted out of the deck fitting, up his shirt, up his nose and reached a height about 4 feet above the bimini top on the boat's flybridge.  I ran the other way as quickly as I could but the stench was already engrained in my sinuses.  I felt so bad for the guy as he and his boat was covered in the sewage. WOW!

So I learned what NOT to do.  A few days later I went to the pumpout station and performed the task without one single drop of the stuff escaping into the atmosphere...and what ever happens...never keep your face above the deck fitting...may be worse tham looking into the barrel of a loaded gun.  At least with the gun you'd be dead and would not have to smell the $#!+.

Good luck

Tom

Posted: October 26 2009 at 11:26 | IP Logged

Hi Ray,

The compression is a little low but not terrible and the compression eveness is encourging--- '75  Chrysler hmm, did you say you had a Paragon Tranny? I can advise on Velvet Drive. The Gear shifter seals (it's actually a hydrolic valve)  have simple 'O' rings. I speculate if it's a Paragon, the design is also hydrolic in nature. An exploded mechanical drawing will reveal much.

The Head Blues-uuch! I think in that era 'closed' sewage systems were not yet required. Subsequent and to this day in California anyway, the only way to offload blackwater on smaller vessels like Cats is to pump-out. Later model Cats do not have the-over-the-side option.  I find the Thetford system simple, lightweight, inexpensive and reliable if considering alternatives. That said, I think the sea head arrangment has pump-out capibility anyway- jus not in the driveway.

How 'bout a wet/dry vac? Just kidding! OR Kids: don't try this at home! OR: how about a spot on Americas Favorite Video- a sure winner!!

Diver

Posted: October 26 2009 at 13:35 | IP Logged

Roy,

My 1985 "NY" Catalina had a Y-valve that went to the deck fitting and to the macerator.  After the macerator the hose went to a seacock in the hull to the starbord side of the single engine driveshaft.  Since my boating is in all inland bays and the macerator did not work and the Y-valve was leaking, I eliminated those parts and my only means to empty the holding tank is through the deck fitting.  The tank is 9 gallons and because we are usually at marinas with facilities, I only empty it twice a season.

Tom

Posted: October 27 2009 at 11:32 | IP Logged

66,

    Flax packing is 'layed in' inside the bore of the bronze 'shell' nut. Your boat must be out of the water or the log would be leaking big-time.  Question: is the old packing still inside the nut? If it is, use the old packing as a template for installing the replacment packing. Maybe use an inspection mirror to check?  Key here is to be sure the shaft is centered so equal clearence exists all around the log nut's bore- no shaft contact with that bore! Push and screw-in the log nut aft to the mating threaded bronze log.  Install two opposing cotter pins (with packing installed, the log nut doesn't spin while the shaft is turning- key for a good water seal. The cotter pins are not particularly necessary at this point, but having them and doing a dry-run install helps when final install is done.   Check bore/shaft centering- it should be fine if the engine mounts havn't been adjusted and the shaft is straight. During haulout, log nuts are commonly removed from the shaft to install new packing, it's easier. Packing the log nut in place is certainly doable, just takes a bit more time for a nice fit. If I recall, there are some good photos on the tread on this subject no more than 6 months back- I think it may have been Mark(?).  

 Can't tell for sure: are these log tube straps off?

Diver

Posted: October 27 2009 at 12:59 | IP Logged

66,

That's a split coupling on the tranny- it's designed to be removed much easier than the original factory couplings. If the coupling bolts and the set bolt are loosened, sprayed with a penatrating lubricant and tapped with a hammer to set up vibration, left to set a few days (with occational respray and tapping) and unbolted, I'll bet that coupling will come off without forcing it.  With the shaft pushed aft a bit, you might be able to remove the packing shell.

Roy

Posted: November 02 2009 at 14:56 | IP Logged

sorry Berg, one project is all I want.  i asked the other boaters here at work...no takers.

Did you try Craigslist?

Tom

Posted: November 03 2009 at 10:28 | IP Logged

66,

Yup, big hatch project: I lost 20 lbs.

sorry, couldn't resist...

Roy

Posted: November 05 2009 at 23:24 | IP Logged

Berg post some pics of that 73

General question: Do the tabs, prop, rudder get painted after being wire wheeled clean?

Posted: November 06 2009 at 09:52 | IP Logged

Ray,

My situation is the same as yours....Long Island Great South Bay - salt water for the sumer boating season.  I do not have trim tabs on my 280 but my rudder is painted and zinc'd, the strut is painted but the shaft and prop are unpainted and the shaft is zinc'd.  I dive under mid season and clean the bottom and running gear and rarely have barnacles on the hull, just a lot of slime.  The rudder does get a few barnacles even though it is painted and the shaft may have half a dozen by the end of the year.

Tom

Posted: November 06 2009 at 11:44 | IP Logged

Skippers,

Re the disussion of paint and running gears: Bottom paint minimizes biological growth, mitigates moisture penetration and maximizes speed-sometimes for looks. For electroysis, paint is not a method of minimizing the effect except to be sure that if zinc anodes are used, there's no paint between the mating surfaces and no paint on the zincs themselves. There must be a good circuit between the salt water (electricaly conductive potasium [salt]) and the grounding straps aboard. If this circuit does not exist, it will cease the flow of electrons from traveling to the zincs (attacking all metal aboard instead) and being dispersed thru destruction of the sacrifical less 'noble' zinc metal. In fresh water, little or no growth occurs as is the case in salt/briny waters. I cannot recall ever seeing paint in driveshafts or bronze inboard props. Rudders: either/or but zincs are definately used in saltwater. Chipped paint on bronze props might to some extent, effect effiency? Trim tabs have large surface areas and thus are suseptible to accelerated corrosion and sun-facing biologics - hence ablative paint and zincs in saltwater. Of particular focus for electrosysis on trim tabs are the hinges and mounting thru-bolts. 

Here's a shot of Lorelei's trim tabs: note the missing screw head lower right- weakened by vibration and electrolysis (it was replaced by drilling a new hole- not removing the old bolt- which is risky), the main hull-zinc on the centerline, the ablative paint and the zincs on the trimtabs. In salty SF bay and with solid ground wiring in place, these zincs degrade fast- 4-6 months to get to 60-70%. 

Bellow: This shot is the running gear after 5 years in saltwater with regular diver cleaning- no paint. Note the two driveshaft zincs. A lot of electrical current flows thru that shaft- (engine is in-circuit). All these percautions are due to salt water operations.

Winter fast approaches!

 We're heading for Disneyland in Anaheim and then San Juan for departure on a cruise and some much needed R&R- we are very lucky!. Stanford Univercity Hospital where I work is a pressure cooker with H1N1 virus patient census running pretty high.

Diver

Posted: November 09 2009 at 11:59 | IP Logged

Hey guys new to the forums just purchased a 79 33 foot Catalina Flybridge. I have 2 issues the head is not there and I ahve this called an engine instrument control cutover box. Here are my problems:

prior owner replaced head with a simple protat potty don't kow why. Can anyone fill me on what type of head would ahve been standard..There is a holding tank and I see 3 hoses and one other cable maybe electric but its not capped off so I am not sure since a bare electric wire in head would be bad!! trying to figure out what I can put back in there instead of porta potty. and what the hoses are for? I figure the one in floor is waste pipe to tank but the other hose is higher up in head and comes through a fiberglass shelf.

Lastly this instrument changeover control does not appear to work the nob just spins freely. Anyone have any experience with these. I can't find any info on them.

Thanks

Posted: November 09 2009 at 13:22 | IP Logged

Blottom,

On the head: sounds like a incomlete project- being the original system failed somehow. Don't know what was the OEM toilet.  Hose at bottom probobly goes to the black water tank and/or pumpout line. Other hoses- saltwater supply or freshwater supply and gas venting-hose. If you can, it might be good to try and trace the hoses or research if mechanical drawings or a vessel operating manual are availible...50-50 chance of that. The exposed head wiring: check to see if there is a circuit breaker for the tiolet at the main breaker station and if voltage at the wire in the head is controled by that breaker.  If no breaker, determine if wiring is live with 12DVC or 110AC using a voltmeter and watching that voltmeter as sombody turns on/off the battery switches and the AC mains. Finding some sort of switch or circuit breaker is key...there must be one or it's disconnected or hardwired to the batteries or AC power...unlikely. It's clear a retrofit was completed/attempted changing from the original raw water system to a self contained (it's own intergal tank) like the Thetford units (a sort of advanced Porta-Potti) that are factory on the Cat 280s. Maybe the project was abandoned due to complexity, access, lack of time etc.  

Not sure what the 'instrument changover control' or 'cutover' is. Generally speaking, dual engine guage arrays on the fly bridge and below are in series and operate simltanously- if that's what you're refering to- but sounds like a function I'm not familar with, a main battery selector or a AC main breaker? Be that as it may, sounds like the set screw on the knob has worked loose- an allan wrench or a small screwdiver and a drop of removable Loctite should do the trick if the screw's still there and the treads arn't stripped. Maybe confirm the switch actually works ok too. It may be advisable to be clear what this switch does. Depending on your electrical ability, a tracing using a schematic or a visual inspection will help.

These things always take more effort, time money than expected! ...be patient...go slow...be clear.

If you can, take lottsa digital pictures of everything, make drawings of wiring and setup a file in a computer to sort things out. Someplace where you can go over things in a civilized manner at a desk, to consider things, EMail photos/info and do research. I appoligize- I'm an engineer by trade and clarity of thought rules.

All the best!

Diver

Posted: November 09 2009 at 13:30 | IP Logged

Blottom,

If the "instrument changeover control" is original equipment, you should be able to purchase the wiring diagram from the Mariners Museum, they hold the archive of documents for Chris Craft pre 1986 with the ones pre 1982 being HIN specific in most cases.  This may help with wiiring for the head too.

http://www.mariner.org/library/chris-craft

Tom

Posted: November 09 2009 at 13:50 | IP Logged

Wow gouys thanks for quick response...I already ordered the infor from mariners museum..i have original manuals but the owners manual is not very detailed and I have no schematics for water systems.

The changeover controls is for instruments only..there is a separate lever that changes control of rudder and throttles that i was able to verify works fine.

as far as head I figured the lower hose waa waste and upper was either venting or water again line/cable cable looks solid thats why I thought it might be a power line. I also contacted the broker i bought the boat through to contact prior owners wife to see if she can shed light on the head situation. The prior owner kept detail records from the day he bought the boat (1990) of everything he did..i ahve reciepts for every component he replaced for years..  The guy spent money on this boat to keep it up so I find it odd he replaced a pump out head with a porta pottie that needs to be dumped. i mean everything is there macertator holding tank etc..it just seemed wierd..

also where does the water for bowl come from there should be a water line to head no? (raw water).

I will take picks like you suggested and cataloge everything too thats a great idea.

Thanks

Posted: November 09 2009 at 13:57 | IP Logged

My Catalina came with a Jabsco manual pump head but there are holes in the floor that seem to be for another type of MSD and I have a circuit on my 12v panel for "toilet".  I've seen photos of other Catalinas on boat for sale websites and many have what look to be a porta-potti shaped toilet...was this some sort of Letra-San MSD?  Did these recirculate the processed waste from the holding tank to the head's flush plumbing?  I am not sure how those worked.

I installed a new Jabsco twist-lock manual MSD, it is piped to the holding tank which goes directly to the deck fitting.  I removed the y-valve and macerator, keep the seacocks for the discharge and saltwater flush intake closed, I use the showerhead to flush the toilet.  This set up works great for me.

Tom