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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: January 31 2012 at 18:42 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: Inflation

The following table shows the cost of a Connie 500 in 1984:

Item #

Description of Item

Price

500

500 Constellation, 50í6Ē, 2/500 HP 6-V92TI D

416,000

025

Arch Radar

6,290

050

Bow Pulpit, Fiberglas w/Rails

2,490

418

Cedar Lined Locker Ė Master Stateroom

830

122

Chair, Occasional

395

756

Cover, U Lounge on Bridge

395

754

Cover, Seat Ė Single Swivel on Bridge

130

171

Cradle, Storage

3,290

172

Cradle, Reinforced for Export

3,790

190

Dinette, ďLĒ Shaped

3,290

303

Fan, Defroster

150

194

Garbage Disposal

295

375

Heater,115V, 1500W, w/Thermostat

340

404

Intercom, 2 Station

385

419

Ladder, Self Stowing at Side Gate

1,290

429

Lights, Docking Morse

575

436

Lounge, ďLĒ Shaped

1,995

467

Oil Exchanger System Ė (2) Eng. (1) Gen.

1,195

456

Props-Spare Set

0

502

Search light, Remote, Dual Sta. 7Ē

835

512

Seat, Single Swivel on Bridge -Extra

375

527

Shaft Stub, Spare, Stowed

950

592

Synchronizer, Dual Station,, Glendenning

1,290

601

Table, Hi-Lo

625

108

Top, Bimini

2,195

112

Top, Bimini with Full Enclosure

4,540

715

Washdown, Fresh Water

175

716

Washdown, Raw Water

465

710

Washers, 3 Sectional, Windshield

720

779

Windlass, Ideal ACW Vertical

2,990

458,285

The figure below shows how much the price would have inflated to if it were built now:

Interestingly that's about what a 2011 50' motoryacht similar to a Connie does cost now.

Pete37

 



Edited by Pete37 on January 31 2012 at 19:07


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eshover
"Deckhand"




Joined: July 02 2011
Posts: 205
Posted: February 03 2012 at 10:17 | IP Logged Quote eshover

It is my experience that this is similar to what boats look like with portable generators mounted on them! 

Emory

 

ted



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"Southern Charm"
1986 Connie 500
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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: February 03 2012 at 10:45 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Emory,

Subject: Window Mounted ACs

The window mounted AC in the photo above looks like a great idea.  Certainly would save a bit of money. I've seen a lot of boats using home style ACs mounted in the windows.  And I'm sure that eventually, as our Connies get older, there will be some of these mounted on Connies.

But it offends my concepts (and apparently yours as well) of what a Connie should look like.  Therefore I'll keep on fixing my old ACs.  The arrangement shown below also offends my sensibilities:

However, it costs only $900 versus $5,000 and up for a new marine genny.  So it's a sense versus sensibilities thing.  I'll still keep looking for a small used marine genny that I can mount in the genny room alongside the Onan. 

But in the meantime I'll "make do" with the Honda EU2000i genny shown above.  As I mentioned before seven days anchored out versus staying in a marina will save more than the genny costs.  After seven days the rest is gravy.  My guess is that it will have paid for itself a half dozen times before you (or I) get around to installing a permanently mounted marine genny.

BTW:  The only time the genny will be mounted here is when I'm actually anchored out.  Most of the time it will be at home being used as an emergency genny.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 03 2012 at 11:46


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eshover
"Deckhand"




Joined: July 02 2011
Posts: 205
Posted: February 03 2012 at 11:02 | IP Logged Quote eshover

I surveyed a 48' cockpit trawler (Heritage but not sure at
the moment) back in the fall which had an AC unit installed
under the FB cowl. Due to lack of proper electrical power,
I was not able to test the AC systems. However, it looked
factory installed and was in the 10,000 btu range.

Overhead duct air conditioning is nothing new on new(er)
yachts today as is helm air and air conditioned sky
lounges, etc. RV's have installed HVAC units overhead for
years, but the reason is obvious.

It seems to me that directing cool air downward is a lot
more efficient than trying the other direction. We have
plenty of space under our cowls for a small dinner party.
So installing an overhead unit would not be a silly thought.
Our pumps provide plenty of "lift" to carry the water to the
bridge. Just a thought and nothing more.

If I am not wrong, I believe that Tony and Vicki have
installed a non-marine unit under their cowl.

Vicki, if you went through with this project, let us know how
it turned out and if you are happy with it. Didn't you use
an RV roof mounted type unit? Doe's enough air
movement get to the unit or does it have fans?

Emory


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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: February 03 2012 at 11:39 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Emory,

Subject: Cowl Mounted ACs

A home style AC could certainly be mounted under the cowl and the output could easily be ducted into the upper salon through the ceiling mounted instrument console.  The problem would be to arrange for a cosmetically pleasing way pick up and exhaust the cooling air. 

One of those marine ACs that use remotely mounted water cooled compressor/ evaporators would be ideal for this location.  But they cost a lot of money.

The forward part of the cowl is visually a very prominent part of the Connie's appearance.  You don't want it to look like the picture of the AC you posted.

I've done quite a bit of work under the cowl and I'm even planning on installing a permanently mounted fan under the cowl.  A home style AC mounted in that space could make maintenance of the FB instrument console difficult.  It looks like a lot of space but just try working in it for a couple hours.  Due to the sloping roof of the cowl space you can't sit up but the wires are too high up to work on lying down.  It's a bitch.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 04 2012 at 10:51


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TStellato
"Deckhand"




Joined: August 12 2007
Posts: 206
Posted: February 03 2012 at 22:58 | IP Logged Quote TStellato


Em,
We have not yet done this project, but it is the next big ticket item that we do.  We are looking at a mini A/C split system.  The compressor is like a small house outside unit that will be mounted up on the bridge behind our bench seat and then the interior unit will mount in the lower helm area (above the helm station), where we took out the old nav systems.  We are still deciding whether we want a 1 or 2 area system.  We had a single system on our old boat and it was strong, cool and great!!!  Below is a link to a sample of what we are looking at.  Not decided on the final manufacture or size yet.

http://www.ajmadison.com

But since the forward head was just completed (granite vanity, new sink and faucet), I am already focusing on this next project before we get to the hot days of summer!

Vicki


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FIVE STAR
1985 Constellation
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eshover
"Deckhand"




Joined: July 02 2011
Posts: 205
Posted: February 04 2012 at 09:42 | IP Logged Quote eshover

Vicki - is this the type unit you're talking about?   The link only takes you to the site but not the exact product.  But this is the only split system I see.  I love this idea and hope it works out!  And it should.   The price is still a lot cheaper than the marine units, even at the higher BTU level.  BTW - what BTU are you considering?   The upper saloon can use all the BTU's you can throw at it on the hot days!  Please keep us posted.

Wanted to get by this Saturday to view the steps but have to go to God's country instead (that would be Fredericksburg Va) to take care of some family stuff. 

Emory

 

 



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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: February 04 2012 at 11:03 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Emory and Vicki,

The FB is one of the major entertainment spots on a Connie.  This is where you entertain your guests (weather permitting) and this is where your guests sit when you are cruising. 

A noisy exhaust fan blowing hot air at your guests will destroy the ambiance of the FB.  And it looks like something that you'd find on a tarpaper roof in a second class motor home park.  It's not something that will enhance the sale price of your Connie.

Pete37



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TStellato
"Deckhand"




Joined: August 12 2007
Posts: 206
Posted: February 05 2012 at 09:45 | IP Logged Quote TStellato



Em,

Yes this is the type of system that we are looking at.  They are half the price of the marine systems without the problems.

Pete,

We have it figured out how to hide it, so that we look like first class trailer trash.  Since we are liveaboards, there is all the other time that we are sitting at the dock with just us and need the extra air.  this is an extra unit to help the existing unit keep  that area cool.  The units are quiet and actually if used underway, they are not much louder than the engines.  Entertaining.....if it is hot enough to use this unit, we probably would not be sitting outside.

As far as the resale value.......I doubt that this feature is going to harm the declining resale value of our boat. And if the day comes that we sell, it can be removed if needed.  I am not going to try and justify any improvement or repair that we decide to make to anyone.  And I am not going to live in my home (boat) keeping everything "neutral" and safe for the day that I decide to sell.



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FIVE STAR
1985 Constellation
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eshover
"Deckhand"




Joined: July 02 2011
Posts: 205
Posted: February 05 2012 at 22:01 | IP Logged Quote eshover

Vicki - well put. I think your idea definitely has merit.
When I stopped by late last Summer, you and Tony
showed me how you were going to go about this project,
you mentioned that this was more for your Summertime
comfort than that of your guests. Those small units are
pretty quiet. And you are right, given the age of the boat,
the value should not be diminished. If so, it would be
negligent given all the other "upgrades" you've performed.

It will be interesting to see (or "feel") how this turns out!

Emory



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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: February 06 2012 at 17:44 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Vicki,

I know the attitude; ďIím the owner of this boat and I can do anything I want to this boat regardless of the consequences or what anyone thinks!Ē  I was a broker and heard it all the time; mostly from people who had hacked-up their boats and couldnít understand why they couldnít sell them.  There is nothing, simply nothing that will turn off of a prospective buyer faster than a hacked-up boat.  There are hacked-up Connies that have been on the market for more than ten years and still arenít selling even at give-away prices.

What does hacked up mean?  Basically, anything that doesnít look like it came from the factory that way (or at least from some reputable marine manufacturer).  Anything that looks homeĖmade is a definite no-no.  You might say thatís unfair.  Some home-made stuff is pretty good.  But youíre dealing with a buyer who expects factory built.  Home-built is a unknown quantity, an unknown risk and a definite buyer turn-off.

You can try to cover up a home- built project but most buyers know the difference between K-Mart stuff and well recognized marine brands.  You can say that due to the lower value of Connies in recent years any kind of crap is OK so long as itís cheap.  But load your boat up with cheap junk and it will sell (if it sells at all) for $60K rather than the $125K it should sell for.  A $65K difference in sale price is still important to me.

The typical length of time a Connie is owned by an owner is only about 5 years and those who say they will never sell are usually the first to go.  I was a little surprised when Emory (who I thought was a never sell guy) recently said he would favorably entertain any price over $130K.  In view of these realities are you willing to load your boat up with cheap junk?

Pete37

 



Edited by Pete37 on February 06 2012 at 19:43


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TStellato
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Posts: 206
Posted: February 06 2012 at 20:06 | IP Logged Quote TStellato


Pete,

First of all, let me say that I have had it with the attitude.  I have not put "cheap" items or upgrades on my boat, nor have I "hacked up" my boat.  I have upgraded for my own personal tastes and also keeping up with the times.  I have granite counter tops and new sinks in the heads and kitchen.  The "original" sink tops were ugly and old even though they were original, they probably looked just as ugly back in 1985 and looked worse 25 years later.

I have a new washer and dryer that works and looks better than the original.  You are going to tell me, that someone would rather have the old instead of new?  I have replaced the carpeting,  blinds,  curtains, mattress,  fridge,  wine cooler, bridge carpeting, all the cushions, new furniture throughout, etc and NOTHING came from KMart!  And that does not even include the "marine" items such as pumps, heads, etc

I have not painted the interior wood or "damaged" this boat by taking away from the classic beauty that she is.  I have enhanced and modernized.  Even the classic Trumphy owners have modern conveniences and modern upgrades on their boats.

If and when I ever put the boat up for sale, I can guarantee you that people will look at my boat first over one that has no upgrades.  I can imagine that you are one of those people that lives with beige carpeting and beige walls, I don't. 

I think that I am done with the forum also.  Others, you can find me on Facebook where I have pictures of my "hacked up" projects and boat.

Vicki








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Bellavita3
"Seaman"




Joined: July 28 2008
Posts: 63
Posted: February 06 2012 at 20:48 | IP Logged Quote Bellavita3

I'm with you Vicki,

No matter what you do to your boat you will always have to face the wrath of Pete.  I'm done with this forum also.  I quit posting about all the things we've done because I got tired of justifying myself every step of the way.  If you can't afford it and you feel the need to sit down with a spreadsheet and a calculator for every dime you spend on your boat, you should get out of boating.  I've held my tongue for a long time, but I'm sick of the attitude also.  I'll see the rest of you over on Facebook.

Pete, I wasn't going to say anything, but I suppose you consider hacking a big hole in your forward shower an "improvement" What a joke!




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Bella Vita
1985 Chris Craft 460
Laguna Niguel, CA
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Grey Goose
"Deckhand"




Joined: October 25 2009
Posts: 200
Posted: February 06 2012 at 21:11 | IP Logged Quote Grey Goose

Vicki and Ron

I too have held my tongue.  I think the majority of the participants on this forum know what they are dealing with.  Don't feel as you are being picked on.  I have seen all of us at sometime being blasted by the supreme one.  We should share our ideas/improvements.  Who gives a crap of what the Grinch thinks.  We all pretty much know something negative will be said "Who Cares!"  Just try to ignore it.  I know how angry I have gotten in the past after posting an idea.  I think all of us have and know the blasting is just frivolous.  Let's just try move forward on this page and ignore the negativity.  It is not going to stop.  Just ignore it and post your ideas freely

Below is the mold of the 52" extended swim platform that I'm building.  I've been blasted about this several times  But now It's being posted on this page. Well I tried to post the photo but the server is having issues.  I'll post it on the facebook page.

Allen

 

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Grey Goose
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Posted: February 06 2012 at 21:34 | IP Logged Quote Grey Goose

OK, I got the photo up this time.  I have the mold if anyone else would like to use it to build a giant 52" swim platform

Allen

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Pete37
"Commander"




Joined: November 12 2006
Posts: 2317
Posted: February 06 2012 at 22:10 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Vicki,

There is nothing particularly marine about your galley appliances, floor coverings, wall treatments, curtains, furniture and other household items.  And they were mostly customer option selected items anyway so there are no standard, correct or appropriate aspects to them.  Replace them with anything you like.  Most of us have also replaced many of these items.

The value of these items is small (less than 10% of the value of the boat) so regardless of what you have selected you havenít damaged or enhanced the value of the boat very much.  The new owner can (and will) redecorate to his or her tastes.

Changing the furniture, household items, etc. around is not hacking-up the boat.  But when you start messing with the hull, engines, generator, major electrical systems, plumbing, air conditioning and other parts of the boat in such a fashion that these functions are compromised that is hacking-up the boat.  External appearance of the boat also very important so anything which makes the boat look tacky can also be construed as hacking-up the boat. ..

When Emory, posted a picture of a decrepit car with a ragged air conditioner and portable construction generator attached to it and inferred that my little Honda EU 2000i generator was going to make my boat look like that I didnít get mad.  He had a point that poorly thought out additions to the boat can make it look like crap.  But I am not planning to put a worn out air conditioner and construction generator on my boat.  Iím not planning on installing either a generator or air conditioner.  My generator will be mounted and used only when we are anchored out.

All I have said is that I think that your scheme for mounting a strip mall type AC evaporator in the middle of your FB is going to look tacky.  You can try to camouflage it if you like but you canít cover up the fan or eliminate the hot breeze it creates.  But if you never have guests up there I guess it doesnít make any difference.

Pete37



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Grey Goose
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Joined: October 25 2009
Posts: 200
Posted: February 07 2012 at 06:48 | IP Logged Quote Grey Goose

Pete
Sorry Vicki would have been a much better response.

Your responses are why participation on this page has dropped to
nearly none. Take a minute to look at all the folks that used to but no
longer participate. You have posted it is because of the economy. It
is not! All of them and most of the existing participants are sick of
your arrogance. Those non-participating members are still friends on
the Facebook page. I would like to keep this page going, it is an easy
way to share ideas, as it was intended to do when you started it. But,
you brought this page to life, I guess it's only appropriate that it will
be you that kills it. I guess enough wasting my breath for now.

Allen
Official Boat Hacker
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Pete37
"Commander"




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Posted: February 07 2012 at 23:28 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Allen,

Yes, you were blasted but not by me.  What blasted you with respect to your idea of mounting a Boston Whaler on an extended swim platform was the fact that the two largest manufacturers of hydraulic swim platforms both said your idea was unsafe and that they wouldnít warrantee any of their products for that type of service.  And both of their warrantees were specifically voided by that type of service.  

What I had said was that a Whaler mounted on the swim platform could be filled with water by a following sea and when filled with water the weight would skyrocket from less than 1000 lbs. to as much as three Tons; yes thatís Tons with a ďTĒ and itís enough to rip the transom off your Connie.  Apparently both of these manufacturers were also aware of this problem.

You have been warned about this potentially fatal flaw several times so you canít say you werenít aware of it.  Perhaps you should see your lawyer about what your liabilities would be if one of your ďextended swim platforms with WhalerĒ ripped the transom off a Connie and killed some people.

Without the Whaler your slimmed down swim platform is far less lethal.  I note that it has been reduced from the original 8í to only slightly over 4í.  However, it could still cause severe handling problems in a following sea.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 09 2012 at 17:04


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Pete37
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Posted: February 07 2012 at 23:34 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Allen and All,

Well six years and nearly 5000 posts was a pretty good run.  Personally, Iíve made about 2900 posts and apparently pissed off less than a dozen owners.  Statistically thatís not too bad.  If you ever become a forum monitor you will find out that the monitor has a moral responsibility to keep the few irresponsible owners from proposing things that can be hazardous to the health and welfare of the remainder of the owners.  That usually pisses the irresponsible owners off.  Sorry that my posts canít always be sweetness and light but thatís the burden a monitor has to bear.

Weíve been averaging about 1500 posts a year for the last several years and Iíve been making about 55% of the posts.  Thatís 825 posts a year or about 2.3 posts per day.  In addition to the actual posting, it takes quite a bit of time to find the answers to the hundreds of questions that come in.

In the process of answering all these questions Iíve found it necessary to compile an enormous library on Connies and Connie components.  The laptop Iím typing this on today has a Connie Library of over 9 gigabytes (2.5 gigabytes of which I offer to forum members on DVD at no cost).

Frankly, if the forum folds, Iím not sure Iím going to regret it.  Itís taking too much time and I get no pay for my work.  So if you guys want to shut the forum down by boycotting it go ahead.  You will probably lose more than I.

Pete37, 2/08/2011



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Pete37
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Posted: February 09 2012 at 23:11 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Back in November of 2006, I started this Forum by registering it with Boat US and sending out letters to all of the Connie owners that I knew of.  About 50 letters were sent out and about 35 owners eventually became Forum participants.

That was a little more than five years ago and in normal times owners of Connies move on to other things in an average of about five years.  So now we would expect that only 17 to 18 of those owners would still be forum participants.  But these are not normal times and in recession periods the attrition is higher.  I think weíve dropped down to about 12 now.

Realizing this, last September I started preparing a new mailing list to notify current Connie owners that the forum exists (most of them donít know it exists).  The list is pretty near complete now and I had planned on finishing it during my February vacation in Fort Lauderdale.  But Iím typing on this PITA tiny laptop keyboard and have decided to wait until March to send the letters out.

This year we will expand the forum to include 46í Pacemakers, 46í Uniflites and 50í Uniflites.  This will increase the potential fleet of 113 Connie 500s and 501s to something like 172 vessels. For the moment the title of the forum will remain the same.

At the moment, I have the ownerís addresses for 58% of these vessels. About 21% are presently for sale and when they sell we will probably obtain the addresses for many of the new owners.  This could bring the total letters sent out to 79% of the total vessels or136 letters.

Regrettably I cannot find the addresses of 21% (36) of these vessels because as the price drops many owners donít bother to document.

Last time I sent out letters I did them personally.  This time Iím going to employ some professional help.  And last time I got about a 70% response; after all it was free and all they had to do was login.  This time Iíll add in a free copy of the Forum DVD as an added incentive.  Even if we only get 25% response that would be 34 new forum participants; 50% would make it 68.  That would be a problem.  It will all depend on how good a letter I write.

Pete37,  2/10/12



Edited by Pete37 on February 09 2012 at 23:17


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Pete37
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Posted: February 10 2012 at 12:08 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: Transom Davits

Suppose youíve just bought a Connie 501 with the semi-standard rig of a 13í Whaler mounted on the FB and launched with a davit boom.  But the extra weight so far up makes your Connie roll like a demon in any kind of sea.  And when launching the Whaler it swings around on the end of the cable like a giant 1000 lb. wrecking ball.  Launching can obviously only be safely done in a dead calm.

You obviously have to move that Whaler to a new location if you expect to get any use out of it.  The question is where?  The FB is obviously too high but the swim platform is too low.  At swim platform height the Whaler might fill with water increasing its weight to nearly 3 tons.  And three tons is enough to damage the transom.  What you want is a location that is high enough to preclude any danger of the Whaler filling with water but a low as possible to minimize its effect on the Connieís rolling.  Placing the Whaler so that its gunnel is at the same height as the Connieís transom deck (the line handling deck) railing is a pretty good compromise.  Itís about 7 feet up which puts the Whaler out of danger of filling with water but low enough so that its effect on rolling is negligible.

This location also makes it easy to load your Whaler with all the junk you will need for your trip from the line handling deck.  No more multiple trips up and down the swim platform ladder while carrying the junk in your hands (and/or teeth).

So how do you get the Whaler from this stowed position to the water?  The answer is with a very old device known as a transom davit.  A modern version of this device (made by Nick Jackson) is shown below:

 

Modern transom davits are electrically controlled so you just push a button to launch or retrieve your Whaler.  And it takes only about 30 seconds.  These devices are usually semi-custom builds so they can be tailored to the Connie dimensions.

One of the neat features of the transom davit is that when lifted most of the forces are directed downward parallel to the skin of the transom rather than perpendicular to the transomís surface.  This allows very high loads to be carried without any damage to the transom.

Another neat feature is that when the Whaler is in the water the transom davit arms neatly hold the Whaler close too but away from the swim platform.  This prevents the Whaler from damaging the mother ship or vice versa and makes it easy to just step into the Whaler, release the davit lines and zoom away in seconds.

The only real drawback I can see is the $6,350 price tag.  But thatís not much more than a simple davit lift.  And, Iíll bet itís less than Allenís extended swim platform.

There are other transom davit manufacturers; just do a web search for ďtransom davitsĒ and youíll get a whole passel of them.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 10 2012 at 12:14


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Posted: February 11 2012 at 17:18 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject:  Extended Swim Platforms

Allenís extended swim platform got me interested.  Itís only 52Ē wide while a Whaler is about 60Ē wide.  So apparently he isnít planning on mounting a Whaler on it.  If he is, itís an awfully tight fit.

I checked on the price of custom made fiberglass swim platforms.  I got a price of just over $6K for a 4í x 14í custom made 1000# capacity platform from the Swim Platform Superstore.  Price is proportional to area and his is slightly bigger so Iíd expect a price of something like $6200.  But you have to add shipping and the costs of the support brackets so Iíd expect around $6500 to $7000.  I was wrong.  I said that it would probably be a lot more than the Transom Davit.  Actually itís about the same.

My web search yielded 100s of custom swim platform manufacturers; some were big outfits and others garage operations.  Iím sure there is a big spread in price and quality too.  Most would custom build to whatever depth and width you want with guaranteed load capacities of up to 4,000 lbs.  Theyíll custom match to any hull shape or color too.  However, what none of them will do is guarantee the strength of your transom.  

Given the size of the platform the most probable use of the platform is as a storage space for a PWC.  And PWCs are sealed so you donít need to worry about them being flooded by a wave.  At first it seems like a win/win situation but PWCs have their problems too.

When a stern wave floods the swim platform it tries to lift the PWC.  When a PWC is floating it displaces about 600 lbs.  But the volume of water displaced when it is submerged is about five times that so the buoyant force trying to lift the PWC off the swim platform is about 3,000 lbs.  Thatís only half the downward force of a swamped Whaler but still a force to be reckoned with.  Ropes wonít be enough to hold it down; metal clamps will be required.  

In summary, the smaller swim platform and smaller dinghy mounted on the swim platform have reduced the loads on the transom by a factor of two but not eliminated them.

Another factor to consider is that the extended swim platform provides a home for the dinghy but no way to launch it.  The transom davit provides both a home and method of launching it.  Iím sure that Allen is planning on using his existing davit to launch whatever is on the swim platform but if you donít have a davit that bumps the price up by about $4000 to $11,000 versus the approximately $6500 for the transom davit..

And of course, the extended swim platform heavily stresses the transom while the transom davitís loads are negligible

This, of course, doesnít make any difference to Allen; heís already committed himself.  But to others who may be contemplating new homes for their dinghies it could be important.

Pete37



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Posted: February 11 2012 at 22:22 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: ConnieNugs

We are now in the 1885th day (approximately) of this internet forum and have made 5313 posts at a rate of about 2.82 posts per day or about 1028 posts per year).  This includes the first years when traffic was low.  During the past three years the rate has been about 1500 posts per year or 4 posts per day.  And during most of that time I have contributed about 55% of those posts (825 posts per year or 2.3 posts per day.  Recently that percentage has risen to about 70% because we are down to about 12 active members.

Strangely, while we have never had more than 35 active members who post, there are an average of 185 people who view our forum every day.  Who are they?  I donít have the foggiest idea.  Why do they read our forum?  I donít know.  But they do.

How do I know that?  Because the forum statistics say there have been 348,100 views in the last 1885 days which works out to 348,100/1885 = 184.7 views per day.  Of course it could be one guy viewing our forum 185 times a day but that seems unlikely.  It could also be a computer glitch but as far as I can tell it isnít.

Our forum is not a chitchat forum.  We donít twitter at each other.  The emphasis is and has always been on the exchange of experience about maintenance and repair.  And therefore there has been a large exchange of information on the components of our Connies many of which are used in other boats.  I think that a large part of these 185 views is bored boaters browsing for info on the parts used in their boats.

If we were to consider the views per month as equivalent to the numbers of monthly subscribers to a magazine we would have a monthly on-line magazine with about 5500 readers.  And these readers donít seem to care who writes the posts so long as there are some nuggets of useful information.  So this forum is useful even if it eventually morphs into a blog.

Iím going to take some of our old post threads, edit them into well-organized nuggets of information on the various components of our Connies and post them on the forum.  Perhaps Iíll make a portmanteau of Connie and nuggets and call them ďConnieNugsĒ for now.  Iíd use a shorter term but they all seem to have alternate meanings.

Pete37, 2/12/2012



Edited by Pete37 on February 11 2012 at 22:28


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suwanneered
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Posted: February 12 2012 at 08:16 | IP Logged Quote suwanneered

 

Hi Pete: Well I guess your still wondering about all the lurkers on your site!Yes,I am one of them and read every post andalways hope to gain some knowledge about boating not just about Connies.I do own a 38 foot Chris Craft sedan which I have restored and she is a real beauty.I am on several forums and don't do a lot of posting but I am still there for the same resaon to hope to learn from some one else's sucess or failure

Regardless if it is a 60 footer or a dingy we all want the same thing!Peace,goodwill and a safe voyage and may your anchor always hold!!! Bill Smith AKA: Suwanneered-Blacksheep

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Posted: February 12 2012 at 10:00 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Bill,

I don't mind the lurkers.  I do the same thing and check out the Catalina forum regularly. Unfortunately, other than the Catalina forum and the Connie forum there aren't many other forums on the Boat US Boatgroups site.  There are a bunch of Chris Craft Woodie sites but they seem to have a completely different set of problems than the modern fiberglass yachts.  Of course a lot of things such as engines, heads, electronics, plumbing, etc. are the same regardless of the age or type of hull construction.  

Hatteras and Uniflite have pretty good owner's sites.  What other sites do you find to be useful lurking locations?

Pete37



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Posted: February 12 2012 at 14:15 | IP Logged Quote MarTex

Pete37,

 

I have been looking around at the forum and have found it to contain a great deal of useful information regarding the CCs...especially since I am in the market for a 501.

I have the hull number off of the 501 for sale on YW in Texas (currently on Lake Travis outside of Austin). The # is CCNYJ33A888. Any idea of its pedigree?

Thanks,

Tim

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Posted: February 12 2012 at 16:38 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Tim,

ďCome MondayĒ was a hard one to find.  I was looking for her documentation a few weeks ago based on her year and location.  The name on the transom seems meaningless.  Thereís no Connie by that name as far as I can tell.  Based on the year and location I doped out that she had to be ďCome MondayĒ documentation # 934037.  The previous name of her last documented owner was Thomas J. Engibous and prior to being ďCome MondayĒ she was ďMiss AmericaĒ.  Mr. Engibous could have been her owner either when she was ďCome MondayĒ or ďMiss AmericaĒ.  I canít tell from the documentation.  So sheís been named ďMiss AmericaĒ, ďCome MondayĒ and ďTime Well WastedĒ.  The last name is not an official documented name.

Thereís nothing remarkable about her in the Yachtworld ad.  She appears to be in reasonable shape and priced about average.  The thing that I would be worried about is that sheís been out of documentation since January 31, 2006.  Thatís been more than 6 years in which you have no record of whatís been going on.  If sheís been abandoned for that long there could be problems.  On the other hand if sheís been owned by a responsible owner who cared for her and maintained her but just didnít bother to document her everything could be OK.  See if sheís been state registered and ask for maintenance bills.  Prowl around the yard and ask neighbors whatís going on.

And, of course, you might want to check www.boathistoryreport.com about her.  Finally, if all this is OK, do a sea trial, have her hull surveyed and have a diesel mechanic check her engines.  These things cost money but are well worth the investment.

Good luck; Connies are great yachts and Iím sure you will enjoy her.

Pete37



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Posted: February 12 2012 at 16:56 | IP Logged Quote MarTex

Pete37,

 

Thanks for all the information. I'll let you and the forum know how it all works out.

Tim

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scottflys2
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Posted: February 12 2012 at 17:27 | IP Logged Quote scottflys2

Hi Tim
If this is the Connie on lake Travis I think it was used by a real estate
company for customer party's . Don't know about the maint but has
been on fresh water for long time and would understand it really
wouldn't need cg docs on the lake. I was going to check it out but
thought would cost alot to transport to the coast

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Posted: February 12 2012 at 17:40 | IP Logged Quote MarTex

Thanks Gemba,

Thanks for the information. Broker said this was the second owner who bought it from original owner where it was on Lake Texoma.

I know it has not been used much in the last two years because the Lake Travis water levels have been very low (its not a constant level lake) due to the ongoing drought here in Texas. I expect maintenance has been deferred accordingly.

I plan to go over and take a look within the next couple of weeks to see if its even worth the survey cost.

Thanks again,

Tim

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Pete37
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Posted: February 13 2012 at 21:55 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: Demise of the River Walk

Arlene and I have been in Ft. Lauderdale for about a week now; on vacation trying to get away from the cold weather in MD.  Today we decided to see a movie and the theater happened to be at the River Walk.  River Walk was a marine oriented entertainment center located on the New River near the center of Ft. Lauderdale. 

Back in 2008 it was packed with crowds going to the numerous stores, restaurants and theaters.  Every weekend there would be musicians playing at an open air gazebo in the center of the Walk.  Dozens of excursion boats and water taxis would be milling about on the river picking up passengers for local cruises and excursions.  The roads were filled with traffic and the sidewalks packed with diners and sightseers.  It was a spot we never missed when we came to Ft. Lauderdale.

It has been running down for the last three to four years.  Today, we had the sidewalks to ourselves with only an occasional passerby.  We went to the movie and were the only ones in the theater.  After the theater we walked around River Walk.  It now consists of dozens of empty stores and restaurants.  There was only one restaurant still open and even that wasnít very busy.

And there was only one river cruiser at the dock with a handful of passengers on a boat designed for a hundred or more passengers.  No one seemed to be waiting to board.  The stores were all empty with ďClosedĒ signs in the windows.

I used the phrase ďRiver Walk wasĒ in the first paragraph rather than ďRiver Walk isĒ because River Walk is effectively dead.  Itís been destroyed by the recession.  Iím sure many of you have similar horror stories.

Iíll be going to the Miami boat show this Thursday.  I hope the marine industry is in better shape than the River Walk.  Two years ago you could have fired a canon down the aisle at the show and wouldnít have hurt anyone.

Pete37



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Posted: February 13 2012 at 21:58 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 13 2012 at 22:11


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Posted: February 15 2012 at 12:28 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: Master Stateroom AC Problems

I bought my Connie way back in November of 1995.  She was only 7 years old at the time.  The master stateroom air conditioner is shared by the guest and master staterooms with air ducts going to both staterooms.

During that winter my Connie was mothballed and I didnít use the AC until spring.  But when I eventually did fire up the master stateroom AC what I found out was that it did a great job on cooling the guest salon but almost no cooling got to the master stateroom.  The guest stateroom proceeded to the temperature of a frozen food locker while the master stateroom temperature didnít seem to move at all.  My first attempt to solve the problem was to tape over the guest stateroom air duct thereby forcing all the air to go to the master stateroom.  This helped but the air flow to the master stateroom was still very anemic.  It cooled the stateroom a bit but only slightly.

My next attempt to solve the problem was to trace out the air duct to the master stateroom.  I found that it was a 3Ē diameter wire wound cloth tube which went from the AC unit in the guest stateroom through the aft bulkhead to the master head.  It then went under the sink in the head up the back wall of the head to a small 4Ē square louvered air register and finally into the master stateroom.  The duct was 8í to 10í long and badly crimped in many places.  I worked on the duct to remove the crimping and restore it to a full 3Ē diameter.  This further improved the stateroom cooling but it still wasnít really very good.  However since we were in a covered shed it was adequate as long as we were under the shed but when we are away from our covered shed and out in the open on a summer day the stateroom gets hot.

Ducts generally shouldnít be more than 20Ē long.  With an 8 foot duct there probably isnít any way you could get decent air flow regardless of the condition of the AC.  However, since the master stateroom cools down after sundown now that the duct has been opened up this hasnít been much of a problem.

My next investigation was to look for another way to route the air to the master stateroom.  The air duct which feeds the guest stateroom register goes into the closet and up the back wall of the closet to a plenum over the closet door and finally out through a louvered register into the guest stateroom.  The air flow to this register is quite strong which is why the guest stateroom cools down so much. 

The back wall of the plenum is also the front wall of a small storage compartment on the front wall of the master stateroom.  By cutting through that wall and replacing the door of that compartment with a louvered register I can route some or all of the air that goes to the guest cabin to the master cabin.  And by adjusting the guest and master register louvers I can regulate how much cooling goes to the guest and master staterooms.  Registers with wooden louvers which match those in our Connies can be purchased at a number of web sites.

While I have planned this modification out and think it has a near 100% chance of success, I havenít actually done it.  Other projects have seemed more important.  But since several Connie owners have reported problems with their master stateroom AC I guess Iíll have to do it this spring.  The whole job shouldnít take much more than an hour.  Iíd do it now but thereís no way to test it in the winter.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 15 2012 at 12:34


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boatman66
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Posted: February 17 2012 at 09:37 | IP Logged Quote boatman66

WHEN IN THESE FORUMS SOME THINGS PRINTED DON'T COME ACROSS AS BEING NICE-IT TAKES A WISE PERSON TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE-IF SOMEONE IS "MAD" BECAUSE OF MIS-INTERPRETATION THAT IS NO REASON TO QUIT A GOOD THING --DON'T GIVE UP PETE YOU DO A GREAT SERVICE TO ALL WHO ARE ON THE CONNIE FORUMMY HAT IS OFF TO YOU SIR--YOU SPOKE OF THE RIVERWALK IN LAUDRDALE AS DEAD SO SAD--ENJOY THE BOAT SHOW -BOATMAN 66 CATALINA FORUM MEMBER

 



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Pete37
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Posted: February 17 2012 at 22:02 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: New Aux Genset Price Leader

A new price leader for auxiliary generators has emerged.  ItÔŅĹs the ROTO Marine Diesel AC Genset at $3,000 from Australia.

Go to:

www.marinedirect.com.au

There is also a Marine DC Genset at the same site for a slightly higher price.  No point in repeating the web data on these gensets.  Read them and comment.  The motor seems to be similar to the one Jim had for his deck box scheme.  Floor space is 25ÔŅĹ long by 18ÔŅĹ wide by 21ÔŅĹ high.  Seems a bit large but it might fit in a deck box.  But why bother when itÔŅĹs set up for permanent installation in the genny room.

BTW: Anyone considering a generator with a Kubota engine should read this

http://www.sailwhisper.com/logs/news_20080225.php

Pete37



Edited by Sonja Lowe on September 25 2013 at 11:06


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Posted: February 18 2012 at 00:11 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi Boatman66 & All,

First, Iím not happy about the situation at River Walk.  Itís very sad.  I hope it can be fixed.  But Iím only an observer and really canít do anything about it.

With regards to the situation on the Forum:

I started the Forum way back in 2006 and have put a lot of work into it.  I hope it has helped the Connie owners.  But I have no special rights on the Forum.  I can write posts and comment on posts made by others.  But I canít censure or ban anyone from the Forum on the basis of what they post.

I read all the posts and comment on nearly all of them.  In most cases I just try to add some information to the post thread.  But in some cases, if I think the actions suggested by the post will cause physical or financial damage to the other forum members, I disapprove of the post.  My disapproval is just my opinion on the subject.  It doesnít prevent anyone from doing what they want (even if itís dangerous) and in most cases they do what they want anyway.

But by some twisted logic, some owners feel that while they have the right to express their opinions, I do not have the right to express an alternative opinion.

Doctorís swear a Hippocratic Oath which says basically ďDo no harmĒ.  I feel the same way about the Forum.  Above all else it should "Do no harm".

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 18 2012 at 12:12


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Posted: February 18 2012 at 12:06 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: ROTO Aux Genny

Iím very encouraged by the ROTO genset.  What the manufacturers have done is to take an air cooled diesel engine and couple it to a generator.  A water pump was then added and seawater was pumped into the exhaust stream; exactly what happens in all marine diesel systems.  The manufacturers have realized that the heat radiated from the 3.5 kVA genny engine is small enough to be handled by ordinary engine room exhaust fans.  Our Connie genny rooms have exhaust fans.  For the larger 5.5 kVA genny an auxiliary heat exchanger is offered to reduce genny room temps.

A while back I had suggested the same thing.  Take a diesel construction site genny, add a sea water pump and mix the exhaust with the sea water.  Small diesel construction site gennys can be had for less than $1,000 because there is a large market for construction site gennys.  So mass production economies set in.  Marine diesel auxiliary gennys, on the other hand, are a tiny market.  The obvious answer is therefore to adapt the mass produced gennies for use in the marine environment and that is what ROTO has done.  Iím hoping that other manufacturers will follow suit and with competition further price reductions will follow.  Perhaps $2,000 diesel aux gennys will be available in a few years.

For those who bothered to read the Kubota reference in my previous post, the message seems to be that some Kubota engines have severe problems.  The situation needs to be resolved.

Pete37



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Posted: February 18 2012 at 14:05 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

HI All,

Subject:  Miami Boat Show and John Deere Diesels

I went to the Miami Boat Show on Thursday (VIP day).  The show seemed a little larger (based on number of exhibitors) but not as large as the 2008 show.  Crowds were light but they always are on VIP day.  Thatís why I go on VIP day.

Most of the exhibits were SOS.  I didnít see much of anything new.  My bag of papers that I took home was very light.  The one major surprise was the John Deere diesels.  I guess theyíve been there every year but I just didnít pay much attention to them.  This year, however, I spotted the 6090 series.

The 6090 is a six cylinder, 4-cycle, turbocharged, in-line engine.  It comes in horsepowers ranging from 325 to 550 at peak rpms of about 2400 rpm.  Because it peaks at about the same rpm as the 6V92ís 2300 rpm, the transmission and props are about the same as for a 6V92.  So if you replace your 6V92s with 6090s the transmission and props stay the same.  And the length, width and height are about the same so itís an easy fit for a Connie.  The best part is that the cost is about $40,000 (no transmission).

Some day in the far, far future (at least I hope itís in the far, far future) my engines are going to need major overhauls (MOHs).  Letís consider the cost tradeoff between overhauling the old engines and installing new John Deere 6090s:

Item

Cost

Item

Cost

6V92 MOH

$18,000

New 6090 JD Engine

$40,000

Top End Stuff

$10,000

Tranny MOH

$5,000

Tranny MOH

$5,000

Paint Job

$1,000

Tranny Adapter

$2,000

$0

Engine Swap Labor

$5,000

Total

$34,000

Total

$52,000

So the new engines cost $18,000 each more than MOHs on the old engines or $36,000 more for the pair.  But the engine swap probably wonít occur for at least five years (2017) at which time the 6V92s will be 30 years old.  Which would you rather have; 30 years old near antique 6V92s or brand new 6090s?

Oh, well thatís far, far into the future.  But itís an interesting exercise.

Pete37



Edited by Pete37 on February 18 2012 at 14:09


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Posted: February 18 2012 at 20:16 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

Hi All,

Subject: Air Conditioner Load Calculator

There is a nice little program which calculates the required size of the air conditioner to cool a room to a specific temperature.  It says, for example, that the 24,000 BTU supplied on Connies for the upper salon should keep it to 80F in 95F weather.  You can download it at

http://www.aquaair.net/Quick-Calc.html

Pete37



Edited by Sonja Lowe on September 25 2013 at 11:07


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Posted: February 18 2012 at 21:44 | IP Logged Quote Pete37

pp



























Edited by Pete37 on January 30 2014 at 15:43


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