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Trojan
 BoatUS Boat Groups/Manufacturer Forums>>Trojan
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Rick1954
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Joined: September 20 2006
Posts: 84
Posted: November 01 2006 at 09:01 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Well, winter isnít here as of yet but I started with #1 on my list of many to doís, Flexeeteek for the back deck. I went to the boat yesterday to measure the deck, you know , around all the nooks and what-nots. I than applied all that information to AutoCAD to send the company a drawing for quotation. This stuff looks and feels like teak wood without the up-keep (we shall see).  It is around 3/16 thick and is glued down ,I have approx 80sf of deck with the two hatches, I will be looking for the border look around the hatchís S!@#, I didnít measure for the round plates in the deck for the fuel and water.

I will let you all know cost and ease of installation. I will also give before and after pic.

Lets get winter over



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RWS
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Posted: November 01 2006 at 20:58 | IP Logged Quote RWS

I used "PLASTEAK" on my 10 Meters' 3 engine hatches and the lasarette hatch. Assuming the product is similar, you may want to use a router to achieve a really nice fine edge when you cut it.

Good Luck,

RWS



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Rick1954
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Posted: November 02 2006 at 12:20 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

The Flexiteek is different than the Plasteak, Flexiteek is made in a sheet like linoleum so it is custom fit, no seams. Plasteak is planks that you cut and assemble, that would look as well but I want to make the deck as water tight a possible , not to mention all that work.

I just sent the drawings down to them, going to cut out the two holes later. Once I get the quote and hold my chest like Mr. Sanford did, they will send me a CNC paper cut-out to my dimensions for a fit test before the floor is made. I am going with the bordered look using white for the seams. The original teak was removed from the boat so I am not sure how she looked, I do believe that this will look better.

Check it out, www.flexiteek.com

 



Edited by Rick1954 on November 02 2006 at 12:24


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Coralkong
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Posted: November 10 2006 at 08:51 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Hey there Rick,

Take before and after pictures. I would be curious to see how it comes out!

Good luck,

Mike

 

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Rick1954
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Posted: November 10 2006 at 10:34 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

WOW, as I expected the price is up there, however, when it is all said an done, you cant beat the price and look of this product. I will be doing the floor this spring no sense storing the floor till than.

I have been refinishing all the teak I can take off the boat, it is looking good. The hatch cover over the steps going down was in bad shape. The weather has destroyed the top layerís of wood ply on that one. I was in a snit, didnít want to purchase a 4' x 8' sheet of teak ply when I only needed a small amount to do the door. Well, I found a place to purchase small amounts of teak veneer. Www.woodzone.com A pack of five pcs 5" x 38" matched natural teak veneer $19.80 wow.

I am hoping I can clean up the veneer on the upper bulkhead (if that is what to call it) near the deck. Some of the upper layer of that veneer is off, around .001 and it is dark gray. I am going to bleach it lightly, then re-varnish it to bring it back without having to replace it. You have to think and be positive yes?

Hurry up Spring.

I will be taking several nav courses this winter so may-be I will take a trip down to you neck of the water this year



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Rick1954
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Posted: November 13 2006 at 12:51 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Ok, next question?

Do you have to have a gen-set attached to the exhaust of the boat engin?

MY boat doesnít have a gen-set installed but I want to install one, if not could you exhaust the generator out the side, if how?. Please some help with this one !!!



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RWS
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Posted: November 13 2006 at 22:08 | IP Logged Quote RWS

Take a look at a small DIESEL gen set that is certified to operate in a gas environment like the Next Gen unit. I put one of these in 4 years ago. Had a special 17 gallon tank made to fit under the rear deck, just outside the stringer.

This 5.5KW genset will run everything on the boat and  it is SMALLER, LIGHTER MORE RELIABLE  and QUIETER THAN THE FACTORY 6.5 gas burner.

GEt the stainless pan and the WATER SEPERATOR muffler system

No invisible, undetectable  carbon monoxie to deal with and with the 16,000 BTU AC running 24 hrs/day she will run more than 3 hours on a gallon of fuel !

Try .....  http://www.nextgenerationpower.com/

RWS

 

 

 



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Coralkong
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Posted: November 14 2006 at 12:57 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Mine is exhausted out the side. I'm not sure of the name of the "muffler" / exhaust system, but it definately has one. (Vernalift? For some reason, that's ringing a bell)

You would need to get one of these.

My generator is a POS, and a known death-trap. It needs the carb rebuilt, but I may just opt to replace it with a small Honda portable job, to be run on the back deck.

 

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Rick1954
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Posted: November 15 2006 at 09:23 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

I looked at that diesel you told me about, not sure I want to go that road, besides I donít need that much power. I have an 1800 open frame that I would like to install just below the deck. I was thinking I would make a compartment that would have a deck door to have access to the generator. This compartment would be vented to the outside along with the access being open. to allow air-flow when in operation.

Now the muffler thing. I looked at the Vernalift site now I am confused even more. Do you have to use water to cool the exhaust ? I have a Colman 5000 suitcase gen that is a very good unit, However, I want to exhaust out of the boat not on the deck, also, I could wire the 1800 thru diodes and use the 12 volt windings to remote start the thing.

If I would place the generator in the compartment that is isolated from the bilge and vented outside the boat would you think it would be less of a death-trap. WOW, not sure what to do now, ( rick need more input)

Thanks guys



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Coralkong
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Posted: November 18 2006 at 09:17 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Now you have ME confused.

Are you thinking about attempting to retrofit a house / land generator onto your boat?

If so, I've thought about this (and discussed it at length) on various forums.

The bottom line was it cannot be done safely. Land generators are usually gravity fed from the fuel tank, are air cooled, and produce Carbon Monoxide, and the gas tank is vented directly to the atmosphere. Nevermind that they are not ignition protected.

I'm not saying it is impossible, just that it cannot be done safely. Plus, your boat would never, ever pass a survey (should you decide to sell it). Also, your insurance probably wouldn't cover it as it would be so far out of the ABYC standards as to be deemed a hazard.

Never mind how much work you would have to do to pull this off.

I'm not saying you couldn't build a vented compartment AWAY from the fuel tanks and engines to STORE it in, but you'd have to run the generator on the back deck, not below decks.

It never ceases to irritate me how much money something costs because it was designed for the "marine" environment. A generator that costs you $1000 now costs $4500 because it is ignition protected and runs through a muffler system.

In many instances, I would tell you to go ahead and use non-marine parts or be smart and save a lot of money (reference your LP stove post), but not in this case.

I think your only options are to either use your generator on the back deck, and just plug it into the electrical inputs on your boat, or bite the bullet and go for the "marine" units.

I'm in the same boat as you on this one. My generator is from 1974 and needs a new carbeurator. The unit is an Onan 6.5K and you cannot even get parts for it anymore. It would take considerable money to get it retrofitted to correct specs (these units were KNOWN as Carbon Monoxide death machines, and had recalls on the exhaust ports which could rot through, never mind the fact that they are mounted UNDER the main salon).

I think it is going to be cheaper (and wiser), for me at least, to buy a small Honda unit and run it on the back deck, and just tie the output outlets into the dual electric inputs on the back of the boat. Now who's to say where I can store it...

I would suggest you think long and hard about this one!

Good luck.

 



Edited by Coralkong on November 18 2006 at 09:20
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RWS
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Posted: November 18 2006 at 23:46 | IP Logged Quote RWS

Running a generator on the deck is a DOCUMENTED prescription for carbon monoxide posioning.  There is a good reason for ABYC codes.

Either do it correctly and safely or don't do it at all. There is no reason to risk your own life and those of your guests.

Any marine surveyor will certainly agree.

RWS



Edited by RWS on November 18 2006 at 23:48


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Rick1954
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Posted: November 20 2006 at 08:00 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Ouch,Ouch

I thought about the generator thing, not going to do anything at all with any generator. Too much to worry about going wrong. Keep in mind I am the new kid on the block, donít know a lot about the boat and or boating. Thus, I will ask a lot of questions about things that may be nature to others.

Running a generator on the swim platform would keep any bad gas (carbon monoxide) from collecting within the boat. The carburetor on a land generator can be changed over to a tankless type needing a pump. Nun the less, I am not doing anything.

I started finishing the teak wood I removed from the boat, WOW what a look. The hatch turned out perfect once I put the new veneer on the top. That was an easy fix ,gluing down the veneer was easy.

Thank again you two for the input.

 



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RWS
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Posted: November 21 2006 at 06:55 | IP Logged Quote RWS

Rick,

We were all newbies at one time. You can read all the books that are available, however getting good advice is a source of valuable information not found elsewhere.  Some things are general to your boat's size range and others are specific to Trojans in general. 

Your enthuasium is wonderful and is the best asset you could have onboard,  especially with an older vessel.

With your vintage Trojan, you have managed to avoid the biggest cost in boating, depreciation.

Good luck with your projects and enjoy her.

RWS 



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Rick1954
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Posted: November 21 2006 at 08:20 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Being a newbie has it rewards you know, you get to make dumb mistakes and blame it on being new to the game. Books are a good thing, however, hands on is the only way to learn anything, having the mistakes you make be the page markers.

I have only been on the water for three years, that has been with my 19ft FourWinds bow rider. I love being on the water, and the people you get to meet are the best.

I got my Trojan at around mid September. She was in poor shape from the old owner and for sitting dry-dock two or three years. I spent five minuets on the motor and it was running on very old fuel. My enthusiasm went up mid scale that day. The day I had to put her in the water to bring her up river to my marina, she ran like a new boat, you could not get any more enthusiasm in me. This is something that will never leave me.

I picked this Trojan up for $3000.00 that is less than some pay for a week-end excursion. She is solid and beginning to look like the splendid specimen that she us to be. She can do nothing but appreciate from that starting point.

She is small at 26ft and a pain to handle backing up with the single engin, but I look at it this way. If she was larger, I would fill her up with stuff I donít need. Hey how much beer can you carry anyway LOL



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Coralkong
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Posted: November 21 2006 at 09:23 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Now, now, you can ALWAYS use more beer!

As for the generator, well, there you go!

 

Remember to pick your battles with the old Trojan. Sometimes you'll win easily, sometimes you won't!

 

 

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Rick1954
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Posted: December 05 2006 at 09:05 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

I hope everyone is having a very nice holiday, and those of you whom are still on your boats, have an ice cold beer for me, or anyone whom would like to have a cold one for me , please indulge, Hey just have one for your self .

The refinishing of the teak is coming out awesome , not much more to do there, so I started the swim platform. Question, should I not varnish this platform or should I . If I do will it turn to sĖt fast ? Boy let me tell you that thing had over one hundred screws in it.

As I said earlier, the teak bulkhead port of the door was dark at the deck line, once I cleaned it up with stripper, I didnít need to bleach it. However, some of the very fine top layer of the veneer was worn off at the deck line. Well I wanted to place a louver in the closet area to move more air thru the port side of the bow, well no more worn veneer. This louver was 9" x 11", was very easy to install and fit well in that area.

Hurry up April



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Coralkong
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Posted: December 06 2006 at 13:24 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Merry Christmas to you too, Rick.

And to everyone else as well.

My boat is on the hard now, and all projects have kind of been placed on hold, due to the cost of Christmas (I have 4 kids, $$$).

I don't see any reason NOT to varnish the swim platform, it is your choice, I guess. I would choose something like Cetol personally, which seems to have some sort of "grip" factor to it, rather than the glossy varnish look. My dock neighbor stained his with regular household stain, and it came out OK. Now, when we pulled the boats, his is going to need another coat next spring, but who cares? Easy enough.

Just as a btw, (and I don't do this often), I am slowly gathering gauges for a new dashboard I am going to put in. WM is selling the gauges for $37 each (for the cheapies, volt, temp, fuel, oil, etc...), and the tachometers for $104 each. I bought 2 new tachs on Ebay for $24 each and the oil pressure gauges from boatersland.com for $21 each! (All are Teleflex Driftwood Signature series). I will be buying more as money allows.

Not bad, eh?

So, so far, that's $91 (probably spent $15 in shipping, so we'll say), $106 on the internet vs. $282! That's OUTRAGEOUS!

I am going to stain and poly a plank of red oak cut to fit and mount the gauges into that, rearranging them so as to please my eye. On the backside of the board, I will install separate wiring terminal strips. 1 each + and - (per engine), and a separate + for the backlighting. This will a.) straighten out the wiring cancer underneath my dash and b.) allow me to add on additional electronics in the future. Cool idea, huh? Gonna be a nightmare to get into, though. My dash wiring is so bad now, 3/4 of the gauges don't work, there are bare wires hanging, nightmare. I'll take before and after pictures!

They don't have everything, but it is worth checking out boatersland.com! Again, I don't normally endorse such places publicly, but the price difference is too incredible to ignore. And yes, they shipped promptly and professionally.

 

 

 

 

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RWS
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Posted: December 06 2006 at 21:01 | IP Logged Quote RWS

I redid the dash on my 10 Meter last spring with the engine refitting. Rewired  everything and reinforced/repaired the factory original dash pod.

We replaced all the guages and the toggle switches as well as fitting the generator fuel, temp & oil guages into the pod.

I highly reccomend the use of a new style labelmaker both to keep track of what you're doing and more importantly, for future reference.

RWS



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Coralkong
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Posted: December 06 2006 at 22:40 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

Yeah, I expect it to be a nightmare. Hopefully the sender units are actually wired using the correct wiring colors, but who knows for sure. (I kind of doubt it, some of the wiring in my boat is a total and complete mystery.)

It is ugly, I can tell you that, and bastardized to the extreme (none of this was my doing...).

I plan to rewire off of the ignition switches, so hopefully, I can pull the sender wires and work from there. I do agree that labeling the wires is going to be key. I plan on using a Brother P-Touch and doing it that way. I DO know that the new tachs are wired differently than the original ones, but somewhere along the way, someone unhooked the original tachs and hooked up a digital synch meter, which didn't work worth a crap, total POS.

My boat is a '74, and sometimes I am hesitant to "re-do" something in a newer fashion, as it takes away from the vintage "feel" the boat has. (Structurally, she is quite sound!). However, in this case necessity (and my skill and knowledge factor) calls for a complete rip-out and re-do.

Well, RWS, keep in touch, I'm sure I'll need you.

BTW, just out of curiousity, is your "Meter" series Trojan an all fiberglass hull, or do you have coring in there?

P.S. I am still unsure how I am going to re-do the LED lights for the V-Drive oil. Any suggestions? I also may just add a lighted LED toggle switch for the gauge dial backlighting vs. the old-school Pull style 4 inch metal switch that is currently installed in an "Oh-So-Tricky" fashion where it is hard to see.

Yes, I will use fusible links. Lots of them, I imagine. I am rather handy with a crimper, so even extending existing sender lines won't be a problem. Trouble-shooting non-working gauges is going to be the problem that I can see. Sender? Ground? Corrosion? Nightmare, for sure. Should be sweet when I am done, though!

I told my wife that for Christmas I will buy parts for the boat that I need and give them to her to wrap them up as gifts. Not a bad idea!

 

Hey, by the way, I went into a woodworking shop the other day. They make both small watch-battery clocks and barometers to put into small weather stations that are the same size as small dash gauges that I MAY incorporate into the dash. Neat idea, huh? (They have all sorts of that stuff in the project section!) And they are dirt cheap! Like $15 for a small barometer. An idea I always wanted to pursue...

 

 

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Rick1954
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Posted: December 07 2006 at 08:26 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Hey nice to hear from you two, thanks for the input..

The wiring in my 76 wasnít too bad, the fuse cluster was a mess, I had to disassemble it and remove all the green-rot to get power thru it. Also, I removed hundredís of feet of wire running allover the place for whom knows what. If you are thinking of making a new harness for the boat you are in for a job, but it can be done. Wiring on a boat isnít as hard as on a car, you donít have all that other crap to deal with. Just have your-self a good DVM Meter with a continuity setting so you can ring out the wires you are not sure of. Donít go and put too many fuse links in where you donít need them, most all of your plus + wires are fused already, all the sending units wires are ground except the amp/volt gauge just fuse the add-ons.

In my manuals, I have wire diagrams I will copy and send to you if you want, they should help , You have my e-mail address, send me your address if you would like me to send you copies.

I was lucky all my gauges worked well, the only problem I had was the fuel sending unit didnít work because the float was rotted off. I had to fix it because the ohms of the new sending unit wouldnít run the gauge properly. On the new gauges you got, you may have to change out the sending units to run them properly.

What you said you are going to do with your dash-board will look really good. I have the express cruiser, my dash is under a lift-up teak cover with black pleather down the center ,and a window to view the gauges thru.

I have been using the Spar Marine Varnish to refinish the teak, so I think I will give that a try on the platform. If the platform looks Ĺ as good as the other teak this boat will look like a million (well you know in my eyes)

I ordered the Classic Fold-Down seats for her yesterday OUCH , I should have made new ones I have all the SS hardware from the old ones . I look at it this way, I can spend more time on something else on her.

Not sure about the Flexiteek deck now, all the refinished teak has that red-ish color to it, the Flexiteek is natural color kind of like cardboard .

Like the idea about the Christmas gifts for your self .



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Rick1954
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Posted: December 11 2006 at 13:25 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

What?

What did I say wrong now

No replys  Boy oh Boy

 

 



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Coralkong
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Posted: December 11 2006 at 16:16 | IP Logged Quote Coralkong

LOL,,,,I wasn't aware you were waiting for a reply....

 

Tell ya what, let's start a new posting. I'll call it Rick's Rehab II and we can resume it over there. It gets confusing after 3 pages....

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Rick1954
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Posted: February 28 2007 at 09:13 | IP Logged Quote Rick1954

Ok readers jump to Ricks rehab III there is a lot more stuff



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